Tertiary

The 78th Primetime Emmy Awards have come and gone, but we’re still glued to our TVs—“binge watching” is a year-round affair, after all. For this week’s podcast, your favorite Tertiary hosts Heaven-Leigh and Justin respond to Emily Kirkpatrick’s recent Substack, “Does TV Actually Suck Now?” 
 
Whether or not you think TV sucks, we’re interested in what today’s lauded series can teach us about ourselves. We explore the golden age of “bad TV,” the emergence of the star-studded limited series, virtue signalling and representation, as well as the complex task of holding Gen Zers’ attention. Don’t worry, we also make plenty of pit stops along the way, unpacking the Ed Sheeran/Macklemore debacle and, of course, paying homage to “car people.” 
 
Want to be a part of the Tertiary community? Follow us on Instagram, send us an email at tertpod@gmail.com or fill out our Google Form to submit a question that we’ll answer in a future episode. 
 
Assigned Reading
Read “Does TV Actually Suck Now?” by Emily Kirkpatrick on Substack here.
Read “The Work of Art in the Age of Mechanical Reproduction” by Walter Benjamin, courtesy of MIT, here.
Read “Home From College, 2 Weeks Later” by Paula Mejía on The New York Times here.
Assigned Watching
“Avatar: the Last Airbender” (Netflix)
“Bluey” (Disney+)
“Firefly” (Hulu)
 
Our intro and outro music comes from “Cloud Dancer” by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com). Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0.

Is “travel” a requirement on the road to being a well-rounded, empathetic person? And if so, is there a correct way to travel? This week, your Tertiary hosts, Heaven-Leigh and Justin, take inspiration from the late, great Anthony Bourdain to discuss the ways travel and new experiences can change your life.
 
If traveling brings a little extra humility, empathy and openness to your life, listening to this episode will have you questioning your go-to drink order and the real definition of “peruse” (hint: it’s not what you think). Tune in and tag along for another week of rabbit holes and side convos with the Tertiary crew!
 
Want to be a part of the Tertiary community? Follow us on Instagram, send us an email at tertpod@gmail.com or fill out our Google Form to submit a question that we’ll answer in a future episode. 
 
Assigned Reading
Read Kitchen Confidential: Adventures in the Culinary Underbelly by Anthony Bourdain, linked here.
Watch any or all episodes of Anthony Bourdain: Parts Unknown wherever you watch your TV.
 
Our intro and outro music comes from “Cloud Dancer” by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com). Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0.
 

Whether you’re a fan of “Fan Fiction” or not, the underground subgenre is making waves in the literary and entertainment industries—and we at Tertiary are paying attention. 
 
For this week’s episode, we examine fan fiction on several levels, including the ways literary norms reify gender bias and heteronormativity, as well as a wider consideration of storytelling that opens a fascinating window into the workings of human creativity. Don’t worry, we also debate abolishing marriage and Justin’s dancefloor chops. 
 
Want to be a part of the Tertiary community? Follow us on Instagram, send us an email at tertpod@gmail.com or fill out our Google Form to submit a question that we’ll answer in a future episode. 
 
A Sample of Heaven-Leigh’s Favorite Fan Fictions (smut free to avoid any awkward convos):
“Transcendent Humanity” by Solaris242
“Peeta’s Games” by igsygrace
“Red Robb and the Burning of the Riverlands” by strangebloke 
Further Reading
Read the full context of the Revenue Act of 1913 here, as well as the timeline of civil marriage in the U.S. here.
Read “A Guide to Fanfiction Terminology” on Writing Advice from the Poorly Drawn Spider’s Wordpress here.
Find Vivian Hawthornes’ complete booklist here.
 
Our intro and outro music comes from “Cloud Dancer” by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com). Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0.

What happens when a classicist, novelist, and pundit enter a bar? (ha ha) Bad jokes aside, we are living through a *moment* in popular culture, fraught with man-splaining, flooded with click-bait nonsense, and—most worryingly—oozing sexism, racism, and transphobia. Who better to guide you through a close read of Christopher Nolan’s “The Odyssey” but your favorite Tertiary hosts, Heaven-Leigh and Justin? 
 
The good news is, between our hot takes on Nolan’s adaptation, we also debate progressive tax systems and whether or not Jason Statham should make any more movies.
 
Want to be a part of the Tertiary community? Follow us on Instagram, send us an email at tertpod@gmail.com or fill out our Google Form to submit a question that we’ll answer in a future episode. 
 
Assigned Reading
Buy “The Odyssey,” translated by Emily Wilson on Bookshop here.
Explore “Homer: The Iliad and The Odyssey (Different Translations of the Opening Lines)” here.
Read Emily Wilson’s scathing review of Nolan’s adaptation of The Odyssey, “An Uncomplicated Man,” here.
Read Joyce Carol Oates’ response to Wilson’s review here.
Further Reading
Read Claudia Dreifus’s exit interview with Ben and Jerry, “Passing the Scoop,” for The New York Times here.
Watch the entirety of Jason Statham’s filmography, duh.
Compare Kilmartin and Cox’s translation of Stanislaw Lem’s “Solaris” (here) with an ebook version of Bill Johnston’s translation (here).
Buy Lydia Davis’ brilliant collection of essays on translating Proust, “Essays Two,” on Bookshop here.
 
Our intro and outro music comes from “Cloud Dancer” by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com). Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0.

Ever get out of a movie and wish you could sit down with your closest, smartest friends and yap about it? Well, Movie Clubbers, that’s the gist of this very special Sidequest. In the heart of a heatwave, we brought our mics all the way to the movie theatre parking lot, just for you. 
 
But we aren’t about vain pursuits, here at Tertiary—your favorite hosts Heaven-Leigh and Justin breakdown the complicated politics in the background of Curry Barker’s freshman film, “Obsession,” including the internet’s incel subculture, Hollywood’s Gen Z breakouts, and the scourge of toxic male entitlement. 
 
Want to be a part of the Tertiary community? Follow us on Instagram, send us an email at tertpod@gmail.com or fill out our Google Form to submit a question that we’ll answer in a future episode. 
 
Assigned Reading
Watch Curry Barker’s “Obsession,” duh.
Further Reading
Read Emma Cieslik’s essay “‘Obsession’ and the Rise of Incel Horror: When Men’s Entitlement Becomes the Monster” here.
Read Benjamin Lee’s interview with Barker, “‘I never thought people might feel threatened by us’: YouTuber Curry Barker on his big horror ascent,” here.
Read “Annie Bot” by Sierra Greer, here.
Watch “Companion” (2025).
 
Our intro and outro music comes from “Cloud Dancer” by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com). Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0.

What does it mean to lead a good life? What does it mean to be a good person? We can all agree the universe doesn’t tend to offer clean answers to these kinds of questions—but your favorite Tertiary hosts, Heaven-Leigh and Justin, decided to tackle them anyway. The trouble, of course, is that a warming planet, barbaric geopolitics, and collapsing economy complicate the ways we ask these questions. Even so, this week, we sink our teeth into existentialism, and we’re excited to hear what you think! 
 
Interested in continuing the conversation? Send us an email at tertpod@gmail.com or fill out our Google Form to submit a question that we’ll answer in a future episode. 
 
Assigned Reading
Read the EBSCO research starter for Either/Or by Soren Kierkegaard here.
Further Reading
Find Kate Bowler’s Everything Happens for a Reason: And Other Lies I've Loved on ThriftBooks here.
Read u/Boring_Net_299’s “Ranking philosophers based on their sexiness” on Reddit here.
 
Our intro and outro music comes from “Cloud Dancer” by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com). Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0.

You’ve been lied to. 
 
We all have, in one way or another. In this episode, your Tertiary hosts Heaven-Leigh and Justin discuss how to create a healthy relationship with skepticism, when (and when not) to “trust the experts,” and why it matters that we consume information with a grain of salt. This just might be the first issue we don’t solve, but we look forward to starting this important conversation with you. 
 
Have follow-up questions or comments? We want to hear from you! Follow us on Instagram, send us an email at tertpod@gmail.com and fill out our Google Form to submit a question that we’ll answer in a future episode. 
 
Assigned Reading
Listen to “Who needs experts?” on The Grey Area with Sean Illing here. 
Buy Tom Nichols’ The Death of Expertise: The Campaign Against Established Knowledge and Why It Matters (Oxford University Press, 2017) on ThriftBooks here.
Further Reading
Watch “CIA whistleblower alleges federal cover-up of COVID-19 origins” on C-SPAN’s YouTube here. 
Listen to “A Defense of Liberal Arts Education in the Age of A.I.“ on Interesting Times with Ross Douthat here.
Our intro and outro music comes from “Cloud Dancer” by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com). Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0.
 

Shelby Rubino is a person too. 
 
Sure, she just finished her doctorate in Clinical Psychology—and yeah, she recently published a peer-reviewed study in Integrative and Complementary Medicine observing the adverse effects of social isolation during the COVID-19 pandemic—but she also binge watches “Sex in the City” like the rest of us, making her the picture-perfect inaugural Tertiary guest.
 
Even though it’s officially Summertime (i.e., no longer S.A.D. season), the team at Tertiary still felt it appropriate to bring on an expert to help us tackle questions about mental health. After all, the kids are not alright. Together, Tertiary’s first trio laughs, cries, and explores topics like resilience and distress tolerance, collectivism vs. individualism, and the importance of loving, supportive relationships. 
 
Want to be a part of the Tertiary community? Follow us on Instagram, send us an email at tertpod@gmail.com and fill out our Google Form to submit a question that we’ll answer in a future episode. We want to hear from you! 
 
Assigned Reading
Read Shelby’s paper, “Covid 19’s Social Quarantine-Moderated Self-Reported Mental Health and Substance Use Among US Adults,” here. 
Further Reading
Listen to “John Mulaney Radio” on Pandora here.
Watch Jason Reitman’s “Thank You for Smoking” on Amazon Prime. If you want.
 
Our intro and outro music comes from “Cloud Dancer” by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com). Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0.

Listen, listeners—you spoke, and we listened. For today’s episode, Tertiary hosts Heaven-Leigh and Justin dive head first into our first-ever listener question: “ What do you think it will take for art-based platforms to regulate/condemn AI ‘art’ over profit?” 
 
For a topic as gargantuan as artificial intelligence, it should come as no surprise that our conversation covered a lot of ground—from publishing industry scandals and algorithm-driven slop factories to the ineffable, untouchable thing that separates manmade art from clunker junk. While it’s clear that regulating AI is somewhat out of the question (thanks, capitalism), that doesn’t change the fact that protecting what makes art quintessentially human is important. 
 
Don’t worry, we also made plenty of time to debate the Alien movies and gush over Jeff
 
Have a follow-up question about AI? Send us an email at tertpod@gmail.com and fill out our Google Form and we promise (we really do!) to answer in a future episode. We want to hear from you! 
 
Assigned Reading
Watch The Drey Dossier’s recent YouTube episode on “The Shy Girl AI Scandal Is Way Worse Than You Think” here.
Read Nabeel S. Qureshi’s Substack, “What Makes Art Great?” here.
Further Reading
Read Walter Benjamin’s essay, “The Work of Art in the Age of Mechanical Reproduction,” here.
Read Britannica’s summarization of Machiavelli’s contributions to historiography here.
Read Jay Caspian Kang’s article for The New Yorker, “Will A.I. Make College Obsolete?” here.
Listen to The Grey Area’s podcast discussing “Machiavelli on how democracies die,” here. 
 
Our intro and outro music comes from “Cloud Dancer” by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com). Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0.

The rightwing techno-elites are trying to hijack your dreams—and the only way to stop them is to listen to Tertiary’s latest episode! In a spiritual successor to our series on “Speculative Creatures,” your hosts Heaven-Leigh and Justin picked up where EP6: Eugenics, Fatalism, “The Last Messiah” left off to dissect the ways both the political “left” and “right” imagine humanity’s future. As these competing visions become increasingly detached from reality, we’ve done our best to bring the conversation back down to earth.
 
Don’t worry, we also found time to touch on werewolves and queer culture, zombie movies and paranoia, and—most importantly—social media bans for minors. 
 
Want to be a part of the Tertiary community? Follow us on Instagram, send us an email at tertpod@gmail.com and fill out our Google Form to submit a question that we’ll answer in a future episode. We want to hear from you! 
 
Assigned Reading
Buy Philip K. Dick’s The Man in the High Castle on Bookshop here or watch “The Man in the High Castle” on Netflix.
Read Slavoj Žižek’s Substack on “SINNERS: CLASS STRUGGLE, BLUES AND VAMPIRES” here.
Further Reading
Listen to The Last Podcast on the Left’s series on Jimmy Savile here.
Read Tiffany Hsu’s NYT article, “Hundreds of Fake Pro-Trump Avatars Emerge on Social Media,” here.
Watch “Hegseth defends Iran War's mission, costs” on FOX 32 Chicago here. 
Read Dana Goldstein’s NYT article, “Did School Cellphone Bans Work? New Study Finds Mixed Results,” here.
Read Justin’s Substack on “TikTok, Hypnopedia, and the Zombification of the Public” here.
 
Our intro and outro music comes from “Cloud Dancer” by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com). Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0.